Hello all,

A discussion started elsewhere on whether or not formatting should be done inside the EDD. I think that discussion should be held here, as there will be more people who have experience with this on this forum than on the other non-public discussion site. Of course most of the participants in the discussion on the closed forum are on this forum as, well, so we can maybe continue our discussion with a larger group.

On this particular topic, there seem to be two completely opposite views, and I would like to hear from people on this forum what they feel about this.

On one side are those who state that formatting should be done completely in the EDD, as this takes the ability to mess up the formatting away from authors - who should not have any control over formatting as they should just deliver content. If formatting is put in their hands the compatibility with existing standards or earlier revision processes would be breached. One message mentioned an 'enforcable controllable environment' as the goal of working with structured Frame in the first place - if I am getting that point correctly (and of not, there will be reactions from the ones on this forum who belong to that camp).

The other side (which, according to the impression given on the non-public site, is a rare minitory viewpoint) is taking ALL formatting out of the EDD and allowing clients to do their own paragraph and character designer based formatting without having to edit the EDD. In this case, the client is not dependent on the person who created the EDD to change the font, text alignment, hyphenation etc. The EDD assigns paragraph format tags and the client can - if they want to - change those paragraph formats to suit their needs. I am a strong advocate of this position and have been using this strategy for my clients with a lot of success.

I do want to answer to the comments about control, just to clarify that the choice between formatting inside or outside the EDD is not the same as a choice between keeping full control or having no control whatsoever. Control or no control is another matter, in my opinion. I can easily see methods to make the paragraph and character designer unavailable in Frame for those who have no authority to make any changes to the company's style sheerts. This would leave those who are in control of the styling the option to define or redefine paragraph and character styles without having to bring in the expensive consultant who created the EDD for them. Changes to the EDD would for example be required to support another font for a Bulgarian translation.

Frankly, I do not want to make my clients dependent on my services just to change the font to Arial CYR if they happen to sell a machine to Bulgaria. Also, I don't want to build full support for all the formatting quirks my customers might ever need into an EDD that will become an almost unmanageable beast (and require expensive consultants to make any changes that do not bring the system to a screaching halt). My customers can create different templates, using different sets of fonts, paragraph formats, character formats and table formats, without ever changing the underlying structure that is defined by the EDD. It is their responsibility to define the look and feel of their documents, and it is mine to make sure the structure is correct. They pay me to build a structured authoring system, not to define their style guide. And if they do want me to create their style guide as well, I will create a template that contains all the required paragraph, character and table formats separate from the EDD. To ensure that their authors cannot mess around with the formatting I will even give them a little script that makes the designer pods go away and stay away. Plenty control, but not at the cost of putting the formatting in the EDD - where I do not think it belongs in the first place.

OK - that was my first round. Let's hear it from the others on this forum...

Kind regards from drizzly Amsterdam

Jang

I am using prefix and suffix rules in my EDD to make things easier for the author (and standardize some headings and parts of names). Now I need to write the content into XML and my prefixes and suffixes do not get pushed into the content on the XML side. I do not find any reference to prefix and suffix in the read-write rules. Is there a way to let FM write the prefixes into either an attribute or the content of an element when writing to XML? I am not interested in round-tripping here, so even if the method is more or less destructive, I would be more than happy to know about it. The only other option I see is adding more work to the extendscript that I am using to prepare the materials for writing to XML.

Thanks

Jang

I'm new to DITA and piloting some documents in FrameMaker 12, trying to get the output that I need.

I have created a ditamap with a structure as follows:

Map title

- Concept A

- Topichead

   - Task A

   - Task B

- Concept B

  - Task C

   - Task D

I would like this to ouptut a PDF with TOC and bookmarks as follows:

Map title => book title

- Concept A => Chapter 1

- Topichead => Chapter 2

   - Task A => Chapter 2.1

   - Task B => Chapter 2.2

- Concept B => Chapter 3

  - Task C => Chapter 3.1

  - Task D => Chapter 3.2

To do this I save the ditamap as a "Book 12.0 with fm components (*.book)" and set the Bookmark levels in the PDF Setup as follows:

ChapterTitle

head.0

Title

title.0

.title.1

..title.2

...title.3

However, the output systematically comes out wrong because the Topichead element, which is just a title and is not attached to any topic, is not taken into account as a hierarchical element in the output. It generates an empty fm document containing just the topichead title, output as a ChapterTitle or Title depending on whether I set its toc attribute to yes. But the TOC is all wrong - instead of taking Task A and Task B as children of Chapter 2 it puts them all at level 1 so I get:

- Concept A => Chapter 1

- Topichead => ignored

   - Task A => Chapter 2

   - Task B => Chapter 3

- Concept B => Chapter 4

  - Task C => Chapter 4.1

  - Task D => Chapter 4.2

If I output using the bog-standard DITA-OT instead of fancy and expensive FrameMaker, everything comes out correctly.

Is there any way to correct this?

Thanks,

Archaeopteryx

Hi guys,

I'm struggling here with some very strange behavior of FM11.

I've got a book (unstructured) with multiple FM binaries (structured).

The first book component is the front cover with some inlay pages including a self generated TOC (out of cross references to the start and end pages).

This book needs to be printed and contains 48 pages total, including the cover as the first and last book component.

Now the first component contains 3 pages and a double sided layout using several self defined master pages (I know there's an issue with deleting surplus pages with no left/right MP).

But that's not exactly my problem.

The problem arises when I try to refresh the book. There's a blank page being created in the first book component, which I got rid of in the first place.

That wouldn't be much of a problem since I can delete that page manually (and it keeps being deleted if I don't refresh anything).

But the real issue is, that the references are updated AFTERWARDS, meaning all page references within the book are one page ahead.

This is unacceptable, as it spans all references in the whole document, which are wrong due to this.

Is there any way I can get FM to not create this surplus blank page?

I'm tight on schedule and cleaning up the mess my boss left me behind with this document,, so quick answers are really appreciated.

-Alex

Hi, we are now using TortoiseSVN, which is free. I wonder if there is any better solutions? I checked FM Guide, there are three: Adobe Eexperience Manager, EMC Documentum, MS SharePoint. What is your reccommendation? BTW, is AEM free?

Hi,

So, we have a document (1000+ pages long) with hundreds of help topic IDs that were auto generated when the document was first created. We now need to access certain sections of the documents and make updates, but the only point of reference given is the help topic ID.

Is there a way in which we can extract the help topic IDs along with the heading name, or at least view where each help topic ID is?

Best regards,

Anshuman

In the office where I work, we are upgrading from Structured FrameMaker 8 in Win XP to Structured FrameMaker 11 in Win 7. Part of the work that I do involves importing xml feeds into Structured FrameMaker templates using an automated process. As I am testing the importing into FM 11 I am noticing that the special character code used for a horizontal tab - 	 - is not translating into a tab after the xml feed has been imported into the FM 11 template. It does translate into a horizontal tab when imported into FM 8. What special character code should be used for horizontal tabs in FM11?

1. It is only relevant for roundtrip, since these special elements will hardly be interpreted by other XML tools, which of course limits the value of XML export.
2. It is unwieldy, to say the least, to require the user to insert special elements for saying simple things that otherwise are just natural key strokes in the regular text flow, and which are not perceived as structural elements of information. Most users would think of these symbols/charactes as control characters, and there is no validation warning that says you may not use these characters/symbols.
3. An element is used for formatting purposes only, whereas all other elements are used for content or structure.
4. There is no automatic way of transforming an existing text that has these "symbols" into some special element when a document is structured with a conversion table.
5. There is no automatic way of transforming a structured FM document to XML such that these special "symbols" get translated to some suitable XML construct.

If the last point could be solved, i.e if all those control characters or markers could automatically be translated to a suitable XML representation, then I would consider the whole issue as solved, otherwise not.

Even without FrameMaker, how do people deal with these things in "pure xml". For instance, when XML is used for publishing (which I know Arnis Gubins is doing), there will guaranteed be a need to control both hyphenation and line breaks. So how do you (they) do that?

How do other vendors cope with these issues, e.g XPP?

Hi all,

Our EDD's formatting makes use of the documents' paragraph styles.  I am now wishing I had not designed it like that since it's not extensible at all, but it's too late at this point to redesign it to make better use of the hierarchical way that Frame applies formatting.

We are now trying to implement Keep with Next, and Keep with Previous pagination properties for various elements.  I thought I could do this through a simple Format Change List defining just pagination properties, but it doesn't seem that I can invoke this once I've applied a paragraph style...correct?

So, is there any workaround for this? (other than a complete refactoring of the EDD) -- I assume that I could create a Format Change List for each time we might use this (about a half dozen), but, since I apparently cannot combine this with an existing para tag, that means each Format Change List would have to redefine every single formatting detail, including basic font properties, etc.

This might be the route we need to take, but I thought some of you wizards out there might know of something more graceful... :-)

Thanks in advance,

Shelley

Hi All,

I am trying to print to PDF a publication that is full of oversize wiring diagrams. The pages are all images ranging in size from standard A3 and A4 siz sheets through to a foldout being 1470 mm W X 297 mm H. We have no problem printing A3, A4 and 630 mm W X 297 H. These are all Portrait images. When we set up our custom print size to accomodate the 1470 mm W X 297 mm H we get the pages without the content, and even some of the oversize pages are not the correct size on print.

The page sizes we are using are:

• A4
• A3
• 630 x 297 mm
• 840 x 297 mm
• 1050 x 297 mm
• 1260 x 297 mm
• 1470 x 297 mm

The procedures we are using to set up the printing are:

1.      Print to PDF (Do not Save to PDF, you do not have control over paper sizes)

Under Print Setup make sure you select PDF Driver and select the Paper size as largest that is in your book.  Example: If A4 and A3 pages, print to A3

2.      Select Generate Acrobat Data and select

Note: Back in FM Print dialogue; make sure Print to File is turned OFF, before you click Print

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Regards

AJ Wilkinson

Hello,

I've set up my Structured EDD with some Headings that have Autonumbering.  I'm wondering if there is any way to put a return between the number and the text?

In other words, can I make this:

Chapter 2: This is the Chapter Title

look like this:

Chapter 2:

This is the Chapter Title

As a secondary question, in my search for the answer to this question, I discovered the <r>. <r+>, <R>, etc. "building blocks".  I can't find them mentioned anywhere in the user manual or developing structured application manual.  Can anyone tell me exactly what their function is?

Thanks!

I just upgraded to Framemaker 10. I am encountering a number of problems when I try to work with my Dita XML help topics, which were last saved in Framemaker 9 format.

1. Using the Default Dita Template

When I open one of my documents in Framemaker 10, the Dita 1.2 template ditabase.fm is automatically applied. Everything seems fine. But then when I convert the XML to Eclipse help (which is essentially html, so we're going from XML to HTML) using Dita Open Toolkit ant scripts, I see this message:

[pipeline] [DOTJ013E][ERROR] Failed to parse the referenced file 'html\c_licensing.xml' due to below exception. Please correct the reference base on the exception message.
[pipeline] c_licensing.xml Line 25:Attribute "xmlns:ditaarch" must be declared for element type "dita".

I then opened the xml  file in a text editor, and I saw this on line 25:

<dita xmlns:ditaarch = "http://dita.oasis-open.org/architecture/2005/">

Line 25 looks fine to me. Am I missing something? 

2. Switching to a 1.1 Dita Template

I tried to work around the above problem. In Framemaker, I tried to set a different structured application as the default one. I closed all files and chose the default Dita 1.1 structured application (it defaults to the Dita 1.1. Composite app.)

Then I tried to open my file: I got this message inside Framemaker:

"Validation of XML failed. Continue?
Error at [FILE PATH], line 25, char 72, Message: Attribute '{http://www.w3.org/2000/xmlns/}ditaarch' is not declared for element 'dita'

Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

I switched from the default Dita 1.1. Composite structured application to the Dita 1.1. Topic structured application. Then I dirtied the source file and saved it. The messages I got in FrameMaker log window included the one above, plus I got a variety of Unknown Element messages, things like this:

Unknown element dita,

unknown element concept,

various attributes are not declared for concept,

unknown element conbody.

If I switch back to the Dita 1.1 Composite application all of these messages diappear except for this one:

Attribute '{http://www.w3.org/2000/xmlns/}ditaarch' is not declared for element 'dita'

My ant conversion scripts from the Dita Open Toolkit are still unable to process this file. They give the same message as is listed in (1) above and the file is not converted to HTML.

Can anyone help me with this problem? I've also posted this question to the Dita Users Group on Yahoo Groups. If I get an answer in one place, I'll post it in the other.

Thanks,

Nina P.

Hi Everyone,

I have looked from pillar to post on this one.

Basically when you open a Structured document in Unstructured FrameMaker a warning appears stating exactly what you are doing.

I am using FDK and have tried this in both Structured and Unstructured.

The test for structure in a document is to read the FP_HighestLevelElement property,

this returns true in Structured but false for a structured document within Unstructured FrameMaker.

Lost with this one, but if FrameMaker can detect a Structured document in Unstructured then I would much like to do also.

If any input at all could be provided it would be very much appreciated.

We are reviving an old DTD and check-in and -out system for use in a new Structured project document. (don't ask...). 

Writers delivered everything in a single XML file, which the -check-in and -out system converts into a FrameMaker SGM file (was originally done in FramewMaker 7. I'm working in 10).

Old documents in the set show that FrameMaker used individual files for each chapter, which were then built into a single Book file, where TOC was done. The name of each individual chapter is used to get the running header. So I divided the master file into individual files, which I am able to print out using Save as PDF... Have now put all chapters into a single book, named it by saving,  and am attempting to process.

1. The book does not print using either Save as PDF or Print Book. The Log includes this statement: "Couldn't open [Book path and name]. Book Error Report.

2. Cannot insert a TOC into book. I can open Add>>Table of Contents, select the desired paragraph styles, go to the Update Book dialog, and select Generate.

All books are rejected, with the individual error messages: Could not open [filename], because it uses unavailable fonts.

There are no unavailable fonts in any of these files, so far as I can tell.

Anyone got any ideas as to what is going on?

Thanks

Hi,

I've intstalled the S1000D pack in FM10. However, when I try to open a new DM I get the following message:

XML Read Report Log

     June 22, 2012 10:52 am

     Source Document: C:\Users\Anil.sahoo\Desktop\New folder\DMC- ATK-A-02-0102-pc-00A-020B-A_001-00_EN-US.xml

        XSLT Processor Messages

     Error at file , line 0, char 0, Message: The primary document entity could not be opened.

     Id= file:///C:/Users/Anil.Sahoo/Desktop/S1000D/xml_schema_doc/brex/DMC-ATK-D-05-0405-br-03D-0 50E-D_EN-US.xml

     Error in XSL transformation. Stopped file opening.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Anil

Fellow Forum Members,

Does FrameMaker offer a S1000D specification publishing solution that includes a Common Source Data Base (CSDB)? And outputs an Interactive Electronic Technical Publication (IETP) as well as a PDF? 

Any info will be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance

FrameMaker 7 - any way to turn off the annoying pop up message "Add new Text Frame" every time I change a header of footer?

Hi...

I think I know the answer to this, but is it possible to control table row or cell properties (like shading, padding, borders, etc) through context rules in an EDD? I'm not aware of any way to do this, but thought I'd toss it out there to be sure.

Would love to hear that I'm wrong.

Cheers,

...scott